How One Woman Built Confidence Through the Power of Horses | Ep. 112 with Hailey Anderson
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Confidence isn’t just about standing tall—it’s about trust, leadership, and self-awareness. In this episode of No Grey Areas, we sit down with Hailey Anderson, founder of Sonny on the Rox, to explore how horses can teach us profound lessons about leadership, emotional regulation, and resilience. Hailey shares her unconventional journey into the equestrian world, the deep connection between horses and human emotions, and how learning to lead them can unlock confidence in our own lives.
From overcoming personal challenges to building a leadership training program at a young age, Hailey’s story is packed with wisdom for anyone looking to strengthen their confidence in life and business. Whether you’re a horse lover or not, her insights on trust, discipline, and self-improvement will leave you inspired. Connect with Hailey and learn more about her work at sonnyotr.com
No Grey Areas is a motivational podcast with captivating guests centered around how our choices humanize, empower, and define who we become. This podcast is inspired by the cautionary tale, No Grey Areas, written by Joseph Gagliano. Learn more about the truth behind his story involved with sports' biggest scandal at https://www.nogreyareas.com/
Transcript
Speaker 1
Today on the No Gray Areas podcast, we welcome Haley Anderson, owner of sunny on the rocks, a multifaceted horse facility in Queen Creek, Arizona. We'll explore how horses can teach us some valuable life lessons while diving into leadership, confidence, and the profound connections between humans and horses. Let's get started.
::Speaker 2
Haley Danny, welcome to the No Gray Areas podcast. Now your last name just changed
::Speaker 2
fairly recently, right?
::Speaker 1
Yes. Just still figuring out how to do all of that. You know.
::Speaker 2
You just got married like two weeks ago.
::Speaker 1
three weeks tomorrow.
::Speaker 2
Three weeks tomorrow?
::Speaker 2
Yes. Yeah. From
::Speaker 2
the time that we're recording this, so congratulations. We are going to jump into a bunch of stuff, but especially with you and horses and your work with horses, and it's it's fascinating, I hope will be fascinating for our audience. But let me just back up a little bit before we get there and get a little background on you.
::Speaker 2
we're sitting in Arizona doing this, but you're actually from Minnesota originally, right?
::Speaker 1
Yes. I was born and raised there, and, I came out here for college.
::Speaker 2
Okay.
::Speaker 2
you didn't really come out here until 17 or 18 years old.
::Speaker 2
Growing up, yours were Minnesota year round. So you were up there for the winters?
::Speaker 1
Yes. I love the cold. Yeah.
::Speaker 2
Do you really love the cold?
::Speaker 1
I did? Oh you did. I do think it's true. I do think something in your blood changes because I cannot handle it the same anymore.
::Speaker 2
But that's all you knew. Like you're growing up in Minnesota winters. So that's just so, you know, until you come down here for college.
::Speaker 1
Yep.
::Speaker 2
And
::Speaker 2
then
::Speaker 2
But what was your first summer like here? Did, did you go home every year in college and miss our summers. Or did you ever deal with an Arizona summer.
::Speaker 1
So I actually got really thrown into it. I worked really hard through college, so my job in college was a pool server.
::Speaker 2
Okay.
::Speaker 1
At a nice resort in Scottsdale. So I was outside every day from about 9:30 a.m. to 6 p.m. just walking like 25,000 steps. So I got acclimated quickly.
::Speaker 2
Yeah. So you're doing all that walking, but you're also in the heat
::Speaker 2
dealing
::Speaker 2
with the heat. Oh my goodness. So were horses part of your life growing up?
::Speaker 1
Yes. So
::Speaker 1
I came into horses kind of on my own I wanted it it was a seventh birthday present from my mom. Okay. She got me a horseback riding lesson. Okay.
::Speaker 2
So you didn't grow up, like, on a farm or something where you were taking care of horses growing up?
::Speaker 1
Well, so my grandpa had gotten horses,
::Speaker 1
later in life. So when I was a young kid.
::Speaker 1
But he didn't know anything about horses. He literally just bought a bunch of horses and decided to own them. So they I wasn't.
::Speaker 2
Figuring out as he was going type thing.
::Speaker 1
Yup. Yeah, yeah. And he got my aunt and uncle into them because they are only a couple years older than me. And so but they so just didn't really know. So I was never exposed to them that much. But I just knew I loved horses. And so that was my seventh birthday present kind of on its own.
::Speaker 1
Yeah.
::Speaker 1
Something interesting I found out later in life, though, my dad passed away when I was four, so he wasn't very. So I didn't know much about him.
::Speaker 2
And
::Speaker 2
you don't even have any memories?
::Speaker 1
No. Not really. So
::Speaker 1
I've learned a lot in recent years from my his dad, my grandpa and my dad apparently had a horse business and was a big competitor in horses and all of this, but I just never really knew or.
::Speaker 2
Interesting.
::Speaker 1
Yeah. Like he slowly revealed that to me as he realized how sure this horse thing was in my life
::Speaker 1
that.
::Speaker 2
Like, horses were big with your dad, but you didn't even grow up with them because he passed away when you were four.
::Speaker 2
But
::Speaker 2
somehow that got that got into your blood.
::Speaker 1
Yep. It's, it's in my blood I guess. And so
::Speaker 1
but I've gone my own route with it because there's a lot of different disciplines they call it in horses. So there's a lot of different paths you can take with it. Yeah. So my path was
::Speaker 1
very unconventional. I would say.
::Speaker 2
Tell us about that because that's that's interesting. I know a little part of the story, but I want our audience to hear this, this unconventional way that you got into dealing with horses or how you're working with horses now.
::Speaker 1
It's honestly, it developed my character a ton, which I'm super grateful for, and that's what I try to pass along to people nowadays, is how to have work ethic and great character development skills that will help you later on in life. And I'll talk a little bit about that because that
::Speaker 1
helped me so much in my journey. But when I was seven, like I said, my mom got me for my birthday horseback riding lessons.
::Speaker 1
It was at this little barn and the lady just does it as passion, you know, it's very
::Speaker 1
not your most professional looking. It's very just there to offer this as an accessible way for people that may not be able to afford it. And so I started riding, and then my grandpa decided to give me one of his horses.
::Speaker 1
Her name was Roxy, and she taught me a lot. Again, I still don't really know what I was doing. She bucked me off.
::Speaker 2
That's how
::Speaker 2
she. So she taught you
::Speaker 2
because you didn't know what you were doing up on her back. And so she was teaching you this. You were going.
::Speaker 1
Oh, it's funny how they like to have that personality. They'll be an angel with someone else, but they know with the right person they need some humbling or something. And so, Roxy Nuna, really teach me what to do and, just become a good rider and gritty for sure. And I started to show with her. I started out doing for H with that trainer and,
::Speaker 1
she got me exposed into that world.
::Speaker 1
I started out doing the English, so that was jumping and dressage and the things you see in the Olympics. Yeah. And then I got exposed. And for H you kind of just do everything. So that entails other things, one of them being the speed events or barrel racing.
::Speaker 1
and so I got hooked on that and so on.
::Speaker 1
Barrel racing. Roxy, she had no idea what that was. So I was bound and determined. I saw what you needed to do and we worked on it.
::Speaker 2
How old was she?
::Speaker 1
Oh gosh. At that time she was about 14.
::Speaker 2
Okay.
::Speaker 2
so pretty old to be learning this new stuff.
::Speaker 2
Or is that for a horse.
::Speaker 1
It depends on who you ask.
::Speaker 2
What I was talking about.
::Speaker 1
It. That's a good question. Oh good one one thing about the horse world that we'll probably also come up later is it is very subjective.
::Speaker 1
It depends who you ask.
::Speaker 2
Okay. A lot of.
::Speaker 1
Opinions, lots of different opinions. So I would say she was in her prime. She lived to be 29. She just passed away a couple of years ago. So like two years almost. Exactly.
::Speaker 2
So that's
::Speaker 2
the horse that you named your business after, right?
::Speaker 1
One of them? Yes. So
::Speaker 1
she was my first pony. We call her. And my once in a lifetime pony. And so she she did it all, and, she defied odds. We got her. She wasn't meant to be a barrel horse. She was an Arabian pony mix. And those are not the breed for barrel racing. And, she ended up having to step up.
::Speaker 1
And I worked my way from four age to a another higher level competition called Saddle Club. And then after that was barrel races and then rodeo. And in high school rodeo, we were top ten in the state in the poll, in the polls. And so
::Speaker 1
we did well together. And she.
::Speaker 2
Was with Roxy.
::Speaker 1
With Roxy, and I just was bound and determined to do this thing. And so in that process, I had been riding a couple of years, and then my grandpa decided to give me this other horse he had raised on the farm named Sonny, and Sonny was I realize looking back now, I should have. How I'm still alive is insane.
::Speaker 1
But, they kind of just. He had maybe 120 days of training on him, and it was very interesting training, like the training, he bounced around the trainers, they were just not very reliable people. And then they just kind of handed him to me. And we're like a
::Speaker 1
horse.
::Speaker 2
You need a lot of work.
::Speaker 1
A horse. And he did a lot of work and I'm
::Speaker 1
ten years old. I think at this point, three years in and I'm like, all right, we're going to reach our goals and we're just going to do what we think is best.
::Speaker 2
Ten
::Speaker 2
years old. How are you figuring this stuff out? Like, are you reading? Are you are you talking to people? Like, what? What are you doing to figure out how to to train a horse at ten years old?
::Speaker 1
So at this point, I wasn't really working with the trainer anymore. She had taught me a lot of my foundational riding, but I think my last real lesson was about ten years old. And then I think I look back at this a lot as I'm teaching my students now. I'm like, how did I get to where I'm at?
::Speaker 1
And looking back, I attended a clinic on my 16th birthday.
::Speaker 1
That was my first real training. In that time period, everything else was just trial and error and honestly, not much error, though, because I would probably not be alive if that were the case, you know, with horses. And I just got really blessed with a good horse that was perfect for me and what I was doing.
::Speaker 2
Roxy or something.
::Speaker 2
Sonny
::Speaker 2
okay.
::Speaker 1
Sonny,
::Speaker 1
but both too. Yeah. And,
::Speaker 1
I had Roxy. That's something I tell a lot of my clients. They want to take on this task of training a horse and making their own, and it's fantastic. And making you a good rider. But it's also very hard because you have bad days. And so it was really helpful to have Roxy on those bad days.
::Speaker 1
She was my old faithful. And as I went through the process, she kind of helped. When my confidence got shot, she was there to remind me, you know, you're good and
::Speaker 1
so.
::Speaker 2
Lesson there, isn't there?
::Speaker 1
It is.
::Speaker 2
If
::Speaker 2
you're going through life and every day you're just getting beat up and there's not some hope or there's not someone that's speaking life into you, that's going to be really difficult. So it's a little bit like you with the horses. You have a horse and you got a lot of bad days with that horse because you're training it, but you're saying that got what got you through.
::Speaker 2
It was you had a horse that was like
::Speaker 2
you refer to as Old Faithful.
::Speaker 2
Go get
::Speaker 2
on her. And you knew she was going to do
::Speaker 2
okay.
::Speaker 1
Yes. Yeah. Yes. And she had her own issues. She wasn't perfect either. She had her bad days. And thankfully how it usually worked out is Sonny had his good days when she had her bad days and, and yeah. Which was really cool because it taught me. And that's exactly. I look back nowadays at my process of where I am today and
::Speaker 1
I'm like, wow, this is just so many life lessons.
::Speaker 1
And so I try to replicate that now with our students. And what I'm teaching these kids is.
::Speaker 2
Instilling
::Speaker 2
life lessons into them. Is there?
::Speaker 1
Yeah, it's more than just horses. Horses are
::Speaker 1
a tool, but for the most part, it's what you're learning about life.
::Speaker 2
And
::Speaker 2
give us maybe an example or two of what that might look like. Like what's,
::Speaker 2
horse lesson that you would be teaching your students that then you would apply to life?
::Speaker 1
One I was teaching them lately is about I do a lot with consistency and just understanding. You know, if your horse is having a mood, how to put themselves in their own shoes and think about how they operate on a day to day basis
::Speaker 1
like, how do you act when you're not feeling that good that day?
::Speaker 1
Or how do you act when
::Speaker 1
you're a little frustrated? Do you have every day where you're feeling fantastic and they start because I think it gets you. You're in a wordless communication.
::Speaker 2
Yeah.
::Speaker 1
And so it can get really frustrating when your horse isn't listening to you or doing everything as you want. And so just in that process, I start to tell them those things, and then we start to just create awareness within them. It's creating. And I tell them I'm like, do you see what you're learning right now? And we teach them to take a deep breath.
::Speaker 1
If they're starting to get frustrated, I say, stop, take a deep breath and right. Yeah. And then they see their horse change. They change. And then I was like you know what you just did. You just hit the reset button and they like they literally.
::Speaker 2
The horse as well a lot of times.
::Speaker 1
And they literally just reset. And I have a little boy right now with
::Speaker 1
like ADHD and a little bit of autism. And he is like he's been riding with us a couple months and he has gone changed drastically in his behavior as a whole because we taught him that process
::Speaker 1
because he can see it real time happening with the horse.
::Speaker 1
You're seeing instant results.
::Speaker 2
Like his behavior, his emotions. He's seeing it happen with the horse.
::Speaker 2
It's helping him realize what's going on for him internally.
::Speaker 1
Yes, yes. And then you just develop as a rider with that and then everything else, your skills and your accomplishments. That just is kind of a bonus that comes with it. So a lot of people come to me, I want to be a barrel racer. I want to do this. And I'm like, we've got a lot of work in here to do first.
::Speaker 1
The rest will come with that. And so, so
::Speaker 1
interesting.
::Speaker 2
So just for our audience and because, some of our audience is watching, most of them are just listening. So you're seeing a lot of work in here you're talking about kind of pointed to yourself.
::Speaker 2
Yeah. So
::Speaker 2
you're saying that if someone what comes next and like, I want to be a barrel racer, you're going, well, you got some internal work that you're going to have to do.
::Speaker 2
That's
::Speaker 2
that's interesting. Why would you say that to.
::Speaker 1
Horses need a no to respect you. And this is something that is again subjective. You have different people that they want to coddle their horses a little bit. And, you know, that's everything works differently for everyone. And, you know, not everything is a one way street. So for me, though, what I found is horses are herd animals and they thrive.
::Speaker 1
They want a leader. And this is also how I've learned about God. This is what taught me a lot about my faith is horses want to leader. They're happiest when they know who's in charge.
::Speaker 2
And
::Speaker 2
then I'm just smiling so big because the connection to God with that,
::Speaker 2
::Speaker 2
my eyes are even tearing up. I get so good.
::Speaker 1
yes. And you already got it. You're already know where I'm going with that. Yeah. Yeah. With that. God. But they want that leader. And a lot of people, they say, no, they don't. That's. And they don't see a lot of people will argue. They don't see people the same way as a leader, but they so do.
::Speaker 1
And so if they know that you've asserted that, hey, I'm your leader, you're not. Sometimes it's not pretty to assert that being in charge, but you, they trust you. So I have horses. I get some horses in that are just the most scaredy cat, untrusting horses. And the ever. And so I have to it gets not very pretty to teach them.
::Speaker 1
Hey, you need to trust me. Like if they get scared of something, that's not okay, because that's if I'm trying to walk by. Like they could get scared of a little tree or something, and they need to know to trust me. If I'm not getting scared of this, then you shouldn't be getting scared of it and you start to see that development
::Speaker 1
in that.
::Speaker 1
For sure they I just got two new horses and they both I just try to take some pictures before I came here with them.
::Speaker 2
So actually right before the
::Speaker 2
I love the, the black one is beautiful.
::Speaker 1
Yes. She's my first love black horses. She's my first black I've ever owned. So I'm really excited. I like to collect all the colors of horse.
::Speaker 2
So
::Speaker 2
So do you. Are you getting close?
::Speaker 1
what are they? I think I've almost had all of them okay, for the most part, but,
::Speaker 1
they just like walking them out there. They were, like, shaky. You could just tell they had no confidence. They had no trust.
::Speaker 2
Because can
::Speaker 2
I ask can I ask a question quick? Is that because, maybe they were abused or there hasn't been training or that's just their instinct.
::Speaker 1
All of it. Like a mixture?
::Speaker 1
A horse doesn't. Nurses stare in my eyes. A horse doesn't necessarily need to be abused by layman's terms of what most people picture do have been abused because it's like.
::Speaker 2
Neglecting.
::Speaker 1
Neglected, or just honestly ignorance of their horse. Their owners can create a horse like can be abusive and cause a.
::Speaker 2
An
::Speaker 2
ignorance of the owners understanding the horse or you saying the other way around
::Speaker 2
of
::Speaker 2
understanding the.
::Speaker 1
Owner
::Speaker 1
of the owner, not understanding the horse. And a lot of people kind of like my grandpa. They just get horses and they have no idea what they're doing. So that's one of my favorite things to do, is help people become first time horse owners, because
::Speaker 1
it's a process.
::Speaker 2
Okay? This is why I love this conversation so much. I'm so fascinated by this because there's something about horses and dogs, too, unlike almost any other
::Speaker 2
animal. Yes,
::Speaker 2
because
::Speaker 2
you. I don't know this about me, but years ago I actually helped develop a safe house for girls. A rescue from human trafficking.
::Speaker 1
Oh. Very cool.
::Speaker 2
One of the things that we ended up developing with that was, was equine therapy, horse therapy and dog therapy. And it's it's one of the most profound works that you can do with abuse victims.
::Speaker 2
Yes.
::Speaker 2
With horses and and dogs. What do you think it is about that? Like,
::Speaker 2
I always wonder, like what? There's something about a horse that can connect to a human or a dog unlike any other animal.
::Speaker 1
Actually, the way you just said that just gave me some clarity that I hadn't thought of before. Is
::Speaker 1
Hey, we hope you've enjoyed this episode so far. Be sure to like and subscribe to not miss a future podcast! Okay, let's get back to the episode.
::Speaker 1
horses something I realize is, since I'm confident I know how to train a horse and help them find their confidence, my horses can go out. There's just something you see happen with horses when they come to my property, and I'm still figuring that out myself.
::Speaker 1
There's something about a piece or something within you that you
::Speaker 1
find that somehow.
::Speaker 2
I believe what you're saying. I've
::Speaker 1
I was teaching a student one day with her horse. We didn't even get on the horse. The horse oral session was on the ground, just teaching her confidence within herself there. Just like I was just sitting and watching the. The second. You could barely tell there was any drop in her communication, but there was just this tiny little ounce of confidence.
::Speaker 1
She lost.
::Speaker 2
The horse.
::Speaker 1
the girl, the person, and that horse immediately crumpled.
::Speaker 2
You could see.
::Speaker 1
It,
::Speaker 1
you could see it. And it took even to me because it was so small.
::Speaker 2
It just
::Speaker 2
how old is this girl?
::Speaker 1
She's like 13, I believe.
::Speaker 2
So
::Speaker 2
what a horse is what, like 1,000 pounds?
::Speaker 1
Yes.
::Speaker 2
Yeah.
::Speaker 2
She you 1,000 pound horse with this little girl. But when the little girl loses her confidence, this thousand pound animal, solid muscle animal is losing its confidence too.
::Speaker 1
Yes.
::Speaker 2
You're watching that happen?
::Speaker 1
Yes. And. And something I realized, though, is I've had a lot of horses sent to me. And I look back as we're saying it now, and I taught them their confidence and I made it sustainable. A lot of people don't make things sustainable. So all my horses on my property, for the most part, if I've done the work with them, they are now lesson horses and they can teach people confidence because I'm I've already instilled it in them and they know even if I'm not present, I think they know that they're in that place of leadership so that they can pass it on to someone new, if that makes sense.
::Speaker 1
And
::Speaker 1
yeah.
::Speaker 2
It does.
::Speaker 1
It does.
::Speaker 1
And that's where I think that comes in, where you're saying, how do these horses do that therapy? Because they found their confidence from good training, good work, and now they're able to pass it on. They have that peace because people just kind of gravitate towards people that are peaceful and steady and.
::Speaker 2
horses sense that, right?
::Speaker 1
Horses sense that.
::Speaker 2
They can sense the peace. They can sense the anger.
::Speaker 2
again, there's something almost mystical about how God made horses and dogs were there. They're able to do that unlike almost any other animal. And they've shown that, like the way they work with therapy or even the years are necessarily therapy horses, right?
::Speaker 2
When you're even seeing
::Speaker 2
that and how they're interacting with their with the, with the kids that you're training.
::Speaker 2
Yeah. Is it just
::Speaker 2
kids in you're training or do you train adults. Is there a chance for me.
::Speaker 1
If you want to? We have been trying to get adult lessons going. We have a block kind of dedicated, but a lot of adults, surprisingly, are not super great at the committing part of it. So, but we have we have one adult. He it's so cool. He how he's even developed since riding horses. I do find adults develop a lot faster because there is also a connection between your mental where you are at mentally, just knowledge wise and common sense wise.
::Speaker 1
You just can click things way faster. You can. I like when people are more developed intellectually. I really go down into the weeds with them of here's the why you're doing it, and then they can pick up off that one, why they can pick up like three new things.
::Speaker 2
It hit me as a client because I love the question, why? Any time we go, my wife and I, she's the same way. So when we go out to eat with people, usually they're always laughing about it because they're like, yeah, you guys asked us a thousand questions at dinner because we're just very interested, but especially in the way.
::Speaker 2
So you probably hate you as a client because you would tell me to do something. I'd be like, why? I want to know why not? Because I'm questioning you, but I just like to know what's behind that.
::Speaker 1
That's my favorite. I like yes, that's my I think before I do everything, basically. So that's where I'm always like, asks me the why? Because it's already there. And then. And I'm like, I promise this has a reason to do it. And so have.
::Speaker 2
You
::Speaker 2
your reader. Do you like to read?
::Speaker 1
Yes. Okay. Not all. I don't get to a lot, but I do love reading a.
::Speaker 2
Great book called start with why or start with the why. So I think Malcolm Gladwell.
::Speaker 1
I think
::Speaker 1
I think I've heard of that. Yeah.
::Speaker 2
And that's his whole point is he's going it's the way that that drives people. It's not the how or the what, but most of the time we're teaching, we're always teaching the how and what. But that's not which is exciting, which excites people is the why behind it.
::Speaker 2
Martin Luther King Jr is famous for. I have a dream that I have a strategy
::Speaker 2
that's true. Like it's
::Speaker 2
the dream, it's the whys that drive us in life. So that you might be interested in that book because it sounds like you, you're actually kind of wired that way.
::Speaker 2
Well, let me go back to the confidence thing, because I think that's so important.
::Speaker 2
And I want our audience because some of them are driving, some of them are hiking right now, and they're listening to our podcast together, and I want to connect with them like some of the things that you learned from from horses, which is what you're interested in, why you're doing what you're doing. But that's what I'm so interested in that too.
::Speaker 2
Like there's so many life lessons we can learn. So the confidence thing,
::Speaker 2
children or adults, when they get next to that thousand pound animal, if they haven't been raised on horses, there's usually a lack of confidence. Right? There's some
::Speaker 1
Right? Oh yeah. For sure.
::Speaker 2
And the horses are picking that
::Speaker 2
up.
::Speaker 1
They pick it up and it
::Speaker 1
takes a special horse. You need a when you go around horses, you want to make sure you're going around someone that knows what they're doing, because that can cause a bad experience too, because a horse can, like I can read a horse immediately engage them. And within seconds is this horse going to be one that takes advantage of you?
::Speaker 1
Is this a horse that has a kind heart and is going to.
::Speaker 2
I'm going to. I'm interrupting your really
::Speaker 2
quick and fast.
::Speaker 2
What are you looking for? So you're saying let's say you and I go out into, some pasture and there's a horse out there. You don't know the horse. You haven't around that horse yet. And I'm walking up to the horse, and you're looking at that horse to try to identify some of these things.
::Speaker 2
What would you see in that horse that would make you think, like, okay, this horse probably gonna try to take advantage of him or this horse seems to be a little scared. What are they doing?
::Speaker 1
You can tell in their eye there is, softness in their eye that you can tell where you just kind of like people. You can tell where they're at just by what's happening with their eye. Some horses, you can look at them and you can be like, yeah, that horse is never going to be. That horse is forever crazy.
::Speaker 1
Like, really, even
::Speaker 1
their eyes. And you can tell
::Speaker 1
and you're just like, yeah.
::Speaker 2
Like that is in there.
::Speaker 1
There's just like I was going to say, just like people.
::Speaker 2
I think we've all been by that around that person where we're like, they're never going to be.
::Speaker 1
Yes. And with horses, unfortunately, I, I'm like, yeah, I don't think there's enough money in the world for me to work with that horse, like, I just won't.
::Speaker 1
you.
::Speaker 2
Have to learn that skill. Or is that something you think you. Because I do think that in life, anything that we do, you know, someone can pick up a violin and they can start playing it. They're going to be, you know, maybe one of the best in the world. There was probably a natural talent that they had, and they had to put in the work to get there.
::Speaker 2
So I'm assuming that you've seen in your life a little bit of both, where you had somewhat of a natural talent with horses, you just seem to breed horse. Is that
::Speaker 2
was that true, or is this all something you had to learn?
::Speaker 1
I think a lot of it was natural. I think I was very blessed because I'd say my last real work was a trainer, was when I was ten. And that's that's one thing that I sometimes get worried about is you always want to know your trainer as a trainer is something people say in the horse world. And, I look back and I'm like, shoot, I haven't necessarily had a trainer since I was ten, however I've done I did a clinic most recently in December, and I learned so many new things and the ladies, it was just so affirming for me.
::Speaker 1
The lady thought exactly how I did about feeling a horse, reading them and everything, and it was just it was cool.
::Speaker 2
Can you tell when you're on the back of a horse? So I'm asking these questions. This is a little bit of my background, which is interesting. If I ever get out and get to ride with you, you'll probably laugh at me because I told you before we turn the mics on. I'm from Montana. Originally.
::Speaker 2
We
::Speaker 2
had a horse.
::Speaker 2
Our. We had one neighbor that we could see across the horse pasture. They had horses, so I rode horses almost every day, hardly ever with the saddle, we would just throw reins on it, right? Bareback. I found out that riding a horse is not like riding a bike. That if you have, you know, you have ridden a bike for 15 years and jump back on a bike.
::Speaker 2
You figure it out really quickly because I got on a horse. I think the last time I rode was probably 12. And then I think probably the next time I got on the horse fresh 30.
::Speaker 2
Oh, I
::Speaker 2
looked like a city kid that had never been around horses like life. You really you truly do lose that a lot, I think.
::Speaker 1
So I see that I
::Speaker 1
was.
::Speaker 2
Around horses growing up, but
::Speaker 2
that's one reasons I think I'm so fascinated by this, because I did. I watched and especially the girl or our neighbor. She really worked a lot with her horses and it trained them really well. But they are fascinating animals. Again,
::Speaker 2
what are some of the other lessons that you've really learned
::Speaker 2
from watching your horses, or seeing them interact with people that are life lessons for our audience?
::Speaker 1
I think you said it very well. You don't until you do it. You don't always realize the impact of it. You know, parents that you know, parents, they spend a lot of money on their kids because they want the best for their kids and their future. And I don't think even parents, until their kids get into horses are and are in it for a while.
::Speaker 1
Then do the parents start to understand even if they're not involved? But one thing I realized with horses is the leadership it taught me because before I went off to do my business, I would have never been doing this if it weren't for God and Him coming in and.
::Speaker 1
Really intervening. But I straight out of college had a corporate job and I was
::Speaker 1
it was awesome. I went straight into working in manufacturing for this very large fortune 500.
::Speaker 2
Part of what you went to school for, right?
::Speaker 1
Yes. Study? Yes.
::Speaker 2
You
::Speaker 2
go. You're working for a fortune 500 company, is actually what you went to school to learn to do, which not a lot of people get to do at a
::Speaker 2
Yes, you're right
::Speaker 2
into this great situation.
::Speaker 1
Yes. My first job right out of college.
::Speaker 1
June of: ::Speaker 1
on a production floor. And so with my shift, I got I got three months of training and then they and their training program basically just informed us of what everything is, nothing about how to lead people.
::Speaker 2
You're like 21, 22, maybe 22.
::Speaker 1
I graduated early from college, so I think I was 21.
::Speaker 2
21. And you're in charge of 100 people on this production floor?
::Speaker 1
Yes.
::Speaker 2
No one's
::Speaker 2
telling you how to lead.
::Speaker 1
Nope. They just throw you to the wolves. After three months of training, they just kind of throw you to the wolves. And they had what we were talking about earlier because I'm this little blond girl. I think they had the least faith in me. So they gave me the easiest schedule, which is the one I wanted. But it was the shift of it had me overlap with all three shifts.
::Speaker 1
So each shift given one day would have about 100 people on, or maybe like 80 people on staff at a time. So I'm more so leading 80 people at once with three different shifts in a day. So that's a lot of different people. Yeah. And
::Speaker 1
I was promoted within six months into a desk. I was like the youngest person ever in this company to get their own office.
::Speaker 1
And this kind of promotion and the promotion they put me into turned me into basically overseeing this whole site in regards to like having a hand over 400 people now, and I had to figure out how to tell I had responsibilities and had to hold managers higher than me by a lot, accountable.
::Speaker 1
It was quite interesting in people.
::Speaker 2
And then
::Speaker 2
that what's interesting about that, Hayley, is I've always said, all of us in life, at some point we have to lead up, lead across and lead down.
::Speaker 2
People tend to be kind of naturals are good at a lot of those work. 1 or 2 of those, maybe, but the one that a lot of times people find difficult is the leading up.
::Speaker 2
Yes. That's
::Speaker 2
what you were saying. So you're 22, 23 at the time. You've gotten this promotion, you now you're leading 400 people. But it's the leading up part that you're really
::Speaker 1
Yes, that was that was hard. It was it was such a web of because now I had an impact, all these people. But I wasn't their direct manager at this point. But the role they put me in was kind of the I would call dumpster roll, where they had all these hopes and dreams, but no way to create them or execute them.
::Speaker 1
And that goes to Haley. And so I turned from supply chain management. I was working now part supply chain management, part HR, and they asked me when they promoted me, they were like, why did I was the only manager in like several years? Well, there's one other manager, but in my group of managers I was the only manager, like knocking it out of the park.
::Speaker 1
The rest of the managers were doing some of the in my class were some of the like
::Speaker 1
doing really badly and costing the company a ton of money? Well, that's what they asked me. They're like, why are you able to lead these people? And these people can't. And and then they went, they're like, whatever it is, create a training program and do it with our next managers coming in.
::Speaker 1
So they had me go and create a whole onboarding program, a three month program.
::Speaker 2
Basically what you wish you would have had, right?
::Speaker 2
Yeah,
::Speaker 2
three months where you're saying I wasn't getting any of this training, so you got to go back and create what you wish you would have had at that three months?
::Speaker 1
Yeah, six months into my tenure in an employment. And this is when I started reflecting. And at this time I had my business started very casually. Me starting doing lessons was a complete accident, and I was doing it for this one family out of like a birthday present gift. And then it turned into them doing a lesson every week.
::Speaker 1
So sunny on the rocks existed, but it literally was operating, making
::Speaker 1
max $100 a week. It was very.
::Speaker 2
Gig,
::Speaker 2
which is more of a hobby for you right?
::Speaker 1
At that time, yes, very part time. I had some horses, I was training and again as personal fun things. So when they started asking me this, I start thinking about, like, people aren't just the same as horses. Like how you my I'm the sweet, all my employees. I'm super close with them. And I knew all about their lives.
::Speaker 1
And we were, you think were friends. But at the same time, of all the managers who had the biggest discipline stack, I did because I held my team accountable and they they start to walk this line of, oh, it's all good, Hayley's cool, we're friends. And then I warn them, I think a big thing was AirPod on the floor at that time.
::Speaker 1
And I said, hey, if I'm telling everyone this right now, if we have if I see an AirPod, it's an instant right up and I told everyone the employees that were closest to me like they thought, you know, oh, Haley's not going to
::Speaker 1
get us in trouble. And I did, and my team respected me. I stuck, I stayed consistent, I held the same line for everyone, and that's exact.
::Speaker 1
And I realized that was a huge part of my success as a leader with people and achieving results. And that's exactly what I had to do. My whole life with horses. The second I let them cross that line, I learned how to pick my battles. That was huge. And yeah, and now I do that with people in my day to day relation ships.
::Speaker 2
In everything you write a
::Speaker 2
book, something about
::Speaker 2
like this is one of the chapters in there was about this leadership that you learned about how you deal with people. But when you're dealing with the horse.
::Speaker 2
Like you're saying the consistency of that horse, starts to think like, well sometimes I can, I can get an advantage over and some days I can't. He's going to where she is going
::Speaker 2
try it
::Speaker 2
fairly often
::Speaker 2
y dad he's, he passed away in: ::Speaker 2
But when we would take the horses out, he must have had the same philosophy about horses that you do, because I. One of the things I remember him always telling me is when you're coming back toward the barn, that horse is going to wander because it can smell the water. It's going to want to run. And you have to let it know that you're in charge.
::Speaker 2
And so I was like, you know, almost 60 pounds at the time, leaning back against those reins as hard as I can. That horse is like grunting, trying to get story. But my dad was probably similar philosophy as you was. Like, you always want that horse to know in a healthy way that you're in charge.
::Speaker 2
But you're saying the consistency is so important.
::Speaker 1
The consistency. And then that leads to confidence and it's
::Speaker 2
Confidence for you or for the horse.
::Speaker 1
Both. And that's where it starts to come into a given pull. You start to get more confident when you because you start yourself seeing that success happen. You're seeing the fruits of your labor, you're seeing the success come out of that. And then you yourself become more confident. And so as you achieve these things, you just start to like
::Speaker 1
your ability and confidence in yourself to do things just climbs higher and higher. And then that's just that goes everywhere.
::Speaker 2
Let me circle back around that. When you were saying that this is one of the things that taught you about your relationship with God.
::Speaker 1
Yes.
::Speaker 2
Because
::Speaker 2
oh my goodness, what you're talking about. Where, when and if our audience isn't there, I hope they'll continue to see God when they get to that point in their life where it's a little bit like you're you used to like the push part where you're like, we're herd animals. We have we want to be led, like you were saying, I really believe that all humans.
::Speaker 2
There's this whole deep within our soul where we want to be loved and led by something that's bigger, someone that's bigger than us. So when we allow God to do that, it starts. We get more confidence in him.
::Speaker 2
Right? Just like you're
::Speaker 2
saying, what happens with the right or not horse? We get more confidence in him and we trust him.
::Speaker 2
And even though there's times where we're going, I don't see where this is going to go. I don't see how this is going to turn out. But I know you're a good God and I'm going to trust you in it. But then the confidence he has in us
::Speaker 2
right, because you're saying the same thing will happen to a horse where you will start having confidence in the horse.
::Speaker 1
Yeah.
::Speaker 2
That's so fascinating.
::Speaker 1
And then it transitions with people the same, same concept in leadership. But I think horses help you learn better because you don't have that. They're not the same species. They can't talk back to you with their words. So you start to learn to have more grace with people and understanding and confidence in yourself to lead other people.
::Speaker 1
or that's what I believe made me more successful at corporate
::Speaker 1
leading people.
::Speaker 2
With how you were leading horses.
::Speaker 1
Yes, because, I mean, it's not quite as
::Speaker 1
detrimental with horses. I mean, they're they're pretty graceful animals. They don't usually hold a grudge against you and they can tell where you're coming from usually. So if you make a mistake, they don't usually hold it against you. If you do, because they can usually tell the intentions of your heart, which is also cool.
::Speaker 1
A lot of people
::Speaker 1
we were talking earlier before this started about assuming, you know, people are really good at assuming what our intentions are. Just like in the Bible, it says
::Speaker 1
We don't know that into the character of someone's heart. Only God does. But we can kind of see the fruits and that life produces horses. On the other hand, I truly believe they have this ability to see our heart.
::Speaker 1
So they have that grace for us as we're developing our leadership ability that when we do make mistakes, they have some grace for us. They don't hold it against us. Whereas people, on the other hand, are not always the same. And so I think that helped me a lot too. And my confidence with corporate, I'm a very transparent person.
::Speaker 1
Some people would probably say a little too transparent.
::Speaker 1
I have yet for that to truly bite me in the butt, because
::Speaker 1
there's just something that I've learned in that of how it all comes back to leadership. You're you're leading in everything, even you're one on one relationships with your best friend. There's leadership in that.
::Speaker 1
Because leadership doesn't mean I'm higher than you. Leadership just means like
::Speaker 1
honestly more so a level relationship.
::Speaker 2
But we even lead ourselves, right? Like if you you've said it's really helped you in your leadership in corporate, have you working with horses and helping young people work with horses? Has it helped in you leading yourself?
::Speaker 2
Because I think that's the number one place that we have to lead, right?
::Speaker 2
Is, is is my own self, my own habits.
::Speaker 1
For sure. I mean, that's where it comes back to as you're successfully doing those things. And it just feeds back into you. However, you you go through hard seasons where everything's either falling apart or just seems like nothing can go right or you name it, you know? And I think those are the seasons where those other lessons truly come in.
::Speaker 1
Because I think when we're succeeding over and over and over again, it's really easy to build that confidence and keep growing. But then in those hard seasons is when you actually experience the most growth because and you have to find it comes back to discipline, to, consistency, but also discipline, because when you're disciplined, you're starting to
::Speaker 1
making that confidence inevitable.
::Speaker 1
Yeah.
::Speaker 2
Yeah.
::Speaker 1
And so
::Speaker 1
that's something I start to notice when I'm in those hard seasons. You start to become most grateful for those seasons because that's where you grow the most
::Speaker 2
And wish it
::Speaker 2
wasn't true. But it's it's just the way life is
::Speaker 2
so true.
::Speaker 2
And then you start to realize that when you are in those, even though that the hard time is, is difficult. Like you're not wishing that on yourself again, but you do realize this is where I grow.
::Speaker 2
We
::Speaker 2
seldom really grow in the good times.
::Speaker 1
And that's where your stories come in
::Speaker 1
sometimes and I it's a blessing. But I've had a lot of life experience in my short time on earth. And a lot of those aren't necessarily good things if you look at it. But I'm so grateful for them now and then. That in itself allows me to lead, and I think that's what a lot of people do, too, is what do you do with the things you face and then that develops you as a leader as well, because also as a leader, you can start to in healthily internalize yourself and process and evaluate, and then you're able to start doing that with
::Speaker 1
other people.
::Speaker 1
Yeah, yeah. Which is another factor. What
::Speaker 1
we were talking about, the why you can start to evaluate and stop and acting out of emotion and being like, why is this person acting this way instead of,
::Speaker 1
taking it personally? Yeah. And that's I think, learning a leader self as well. It's just it's just a big web. I feel like it's turned into a web right now, but.
::Speaker 2
Yeah, absolutely. Well, Hayley, tell us, I know you told us one story, but one does one of the what is one of the most rewarding moments that you've had
::Speaker 2
your training with them in horses?
::Speaker 1
Oh,
::Speaker 1
this episode. Be sure to leave us a five star review. And if you're watching on YouTube, leave a comment on something you'll take away. All right, let's hop back into the remainder of the episode.
::Speaker 1
One most recently. This was a good one for both me internally and then also for one of my students. So, you know, we don't have many falls very often. I take pride in that. And we do teach people. We I take a lot of pride in how quickly we develop our students, yet somehow safely and we just found this rhythm.
::Speaker 1
And I had this new girl. She was kind of scared to ride a horse. And this she finally worked up the courage because her sister had been riding. She finally worked up the courage to ride. And
::Speaker 1
it was interesting whether we were kind of in that weather shift. And horses act different in that weather, and they're sensitive to it.
::Speaker 1
And I have very good horses. And I put her on this and like we had really chill horses, but we did this activity at the end of our ride. We do every day. And for some reason, something scared the horse behind her. And so it caused that horse to run into her horse. Her horse tripped and she fell off and she was right next to me, but she still fell.
::Speaker 1
And it just it was a moment of chaos. Yeah. Which happens. Yeah. Yeah. But you know, these are. Yeah. Yes. And you know,
::Speaker 1
with young kids, it's especially nerve wracking. But she cried and you know what they always say get back on the horse. And so now we immediately through her crying got her back on the horse. And then I was like, hey, I need you to be on this horse and just be okay.
::Speaker 1
And so I had her. She just sat there at the trailer while the other horses did things, and she just sat on the horse and just pet them and just tried to work on pushing through that. That's scary. Again. This girl was already super nervous. Yeah, she was doing phenomenal.
::Speaker 2
What you were
::Speaker 2
saying right about she was getting the confidence,
::Speaker 2
which is giving the horse confidence.
::Speaker 1
Right?
::Speaker 1
Yep. She needed it big time. And of course like the thing that never happens had to happen. And and for me, you know, as someone, as a business owner or I know a lot of people are in this position, no matter where they're at in life, is like there's just feelings that come with that for you being a part of it.
::Speaker 1
And you're you start to think, oh no, what are these people going to think? And you start to think about? I realize a lot of times I start thinking about the negative of what people could think. Yeah.
::Speaker 2
And
::Speaker 2
most of us do.
::Speaker 1
Most people do. And that's I think my biggest lesson I'm learning right now is as a business owner and operating with a lot of people as giving people the benefit of the doubt. And my clients, we I communicate a lot about we grace having it both ways, you know, because people start to have unrealistic expectations for a business in general.
::Speaker 1
You know, sometimes they think I'm like, target. I don't know why I always go to target, but
::Speaker 1
target is a well-oiled machine, but a lot of times, these small businesses, you know, you start somewhere, and then you got to work your way up and sometimes I have that image of, I need to be the target. I need to be that well-oiled machine. And so when those moments happen, you're like, shoot. And that can start to fester on you as a person mentally.
::Speaker 1
And so in that situation, it taught me a lot of going back to finding that confidence in myself and that leadership, speaking that positive of what you're already doing,
::Speaker 1
but also knowing your identity, you know, if people
::Speaker 1
yes, if this is rooted in Christ, of course, because if people when I know my identity, if it doesn't work out with one of my clients, then it doesn't work out, and that's going to be okay.
::Speaker 1
And and so that was a good moment that presented that for me.
::Speaker 1
I'm learning in this process. But then this girl is learning. And her next lesson was done by, one of the other trainers. And it was it was really scary for her, that girl, to get back on the horse. But we took special precautions. The trainer was telling me about how she went about it.
::Speaker 1
We just went the extra mile to make it comfortable for this girl. In a way like you probably don't really hear about people doing, but this little girl now is back to riding the horses. She's still nervous, but regaining that confidence
::Speaker 1
lesson. She's learning though, right?
::Speaker 1
just.
::Speaker 2
Why you do what you do.
::Speaker 1
Yes. And she's six years old. Yeah. So to learn that at six years old and just she's just going to keep growing and and magnifying it as she continues her journey riding horses so
::Speaker 1
well.
::Speaker 2
That's amazing. Well, Hayley, we're looking forward to reading this book that you're going to write something.
::Speaker 2
I just threw it out there. I don't know if you will, but I think
::Speaker 2
there's a book there.
::Speaker 1
I try, I'm working on it.
::Speaker 2
I watch
::Speaker 2
as you write things down. You got to have a lot of notes taken here. Well,
::Speaker 2
how do people get a hold of you? If our audience wanted to reach out to you, if they wanted to see what you're doing, what would they do?
::Speaker 1
So we used to do a lot on social media, but with how things have been growing, we don't update as often. I kind of use Instagram as sort of my portfolio. What am I doing? What are we up to? So Instagram is sunny on the rocks. You should be able to find that sunny is so and NY and then rocks is rocks.
::Speaker 1
After sunny and rocky and then that's pretty easy source to find us. We are on Facebook. That's the best place to start working with us through our programs.
::Speaker 2
Instagram's the sunny on the rocks.
::Speaker 1
Sunny on the rocks, and then Instagram's more our portfolio. What are we up to? And then we have TikTok, if that. I have to figure out what's going on with that. And then we
::Speaker 1
do have a website and everything. So we're always trying to update and make changes and things like that.
::Speaker 2
We'll
::Speaker 2
have that information in the description as well. So wrapping up here, this is one of my favorite parts. We'll see if you can stop me. Two truths and a lie. You just can give me three statements. Two of them would be truths. One would be a lie. So our audience, myself, we've been talking to you here for about 45 minutes to an hour.
::Speaker 2
See how well we got to know you. So two truths, one lie. I have to guess the lie.
::Speaker 2
okay.
::Speaker 1
So I have been to 50 states all 50 I guess I have been to every continent except Alaska
::Speaker 1
or Antarctica. Oh my gosh. Oh the ice and then I have
::Speaker 1
been to over 100 zoos.
::Speaker 2
Yeah. Okay. So you like to travel?
::Speaker 1
Yeah, I figured I'd go with the numbers.
::Speaker 2
I mean,
::Speaker 2
except Antarctica, 100 zoos.
::Speaker 2
I'm going to go with every continent except Antarctica. It's true.
::Speaker 2
Is that true?
::Speaker 2
Oh. Come back. That's I, I lost.
::Speaker 1
30, but I'm working on it right now.
::Speaker 1
Okay.
::Speaker 2
Which continent haven't you been to or continent?
::Speaker 1
Honestly, most of them. I.
::Speaker 2
So you've
::Speaker 2
traveled among the states?
::Speaker 1
I've traveled amongst the states. And now I'm working. I should be knocking. I'm knocking off Asia and South America this year.
::Speaker 1
And then.
::Speaker 2
My winning streak that I
::Speaker 2
have to.
::Speaker 1
Ice.
::Speaker 2
Congrats.
::Speaker 1
yeah. So I'm very traveled. But yeah, working on the international now.
::Speaker 2
Take courses internationally.
::Speaker 1
So
::Speaker 1
yes.
::Speaker 2
Well Haley, thank you so much for joining us and and sharing part of your journey. It's been fascinating and see and we hope to see and hear more about
::Speaker 2
you.
::Speaker 1
Thank you. I appreciate you guys having me on. I really enjoy your podcast.
::Speaker 2
So
::Speaker 2
thanks, Haley.
::Speaker 1
Wow. I left this conversation with Haley feeling so inspired. And I hope you did too. Stay tuned for more episodes every other Wednesday and be sure to like, follow, and subscribe to our YouTube channel. We'll see you back at her next episode. Have a great week!
